Argument against God’s existence refuted

I saw this meme arguing for God’s non-existence on Facebook and decided to respond below:

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At first glance it may seem like an air-tight argument that would be tough for the theist to refute. But in reality it’s nothing new and has numerous problems.

I have no qualms with saying God is omnipotent, omniscient, and morally perfect. Therefore I don’t have qualms with anything that necessarily follows from God’s omnipotence, omniscience, and perfection.

But the argument falls apart when it is asserted that “evil exists.” I can already hear the objections: “You’re saying evil doesn’t exist? Haven’t you ever studied history, read the news, or even stepped outside your front door before? Of course evil exists!” I have done and continue to do all of those things, but hear me out.

It is clear that people can commit and suffer evil acts such as killing, lying, stealing, committing adultery, and so on. Those are examples of moral evils. It is also clear that people suffer from evils such as hearing or vision loss, viral infections, diseases and illnesses of all sorts, and so on. Those are examples of natural evils.

What moral evils and natural evils have in common is the deficiency or lack of something good. When we kill or steal from someone, we fail to treat that person as they ought to be treated, namely as beings with the right to life and property or, more generally speaking, as ends in themselves. And when someone is afflicted by a terrible disease like ALS, they lose inherently good things such as muscle strength, basic motor functions, and eventually life itself.

Now, by virtue of the fact that we can only define evil in terms of a lack of something, namely something good, it is therefore rendered impossible for evil to exist as such, that is, as a substance. This is why nothing can be “pure evil.” In all acts of evil there is a modicum of good perceived by the evildoer, and thus no one commits evil for its own sake. Even serial killers or mass murderers don’t serially kill because it’s evil, but because they get some sort of good out of it, whether it’s feelings of pleasure or power or justice. Pleasure, power, and justice are all objectively good things, but a) the ends don’t justify the means and b) the desire for as well as the perception of these goods is disordered. Just because there are some perceived goods that the killer is trying to obtain, doesn’t make killing someone good. I’m merely using this example to show that one can never define or describe evil without reference to good. Good exists per se, but evil does not exist per se. It’s like order and chaos. One cannot understand chaos without reference to order. Order exists per se, but chaos does not. Does that all make sense? I hope so.

I’m not quite done yet, however. As I’ve shown, the proposition “evil exists” is not true, and therefore the rest of the argument cannot work. Let’s still take a look at it anyway because our atheist meme maker can easily substitute “moral and natural evils” for “evil” into his argument.

So, with that being said, the final premise before the conclusion asserts that if God were actually omnipotent and morally perfect, He would have the desire and capability to eliminate moral and natural evils from the world, but because people still commit and suffer from moral and natural evils, God is either not omnipotent or morally perfect and, either way, cannot exist.

This is still wrong because it attributes moral and natural evils to an all-good God. If God is omnipotent, omniscient, and perfect, God necessarily has to be good. But if God is the source of moral and natural evils, He would not be pure goodness, which would render Christianity and theism in general incoherent and downright false. So from whence does moral evil come? The free will of human beings. And what about natural evil? I would stay consistent with the Christian tradition and attribute the existence of natural evil to the Fall of Adam and Eve in the Garden, though this is a doctrine of revelation and not of natural reason. So because that is the case, I shall set it aside at this time.

Now I could provide a defense of free will, for I imagine most atheists deny its existence and would still not remain fully convinced that my argument works and their argument doesn’t. Perhaps I will do it at some point as a follow-up post, but I will definitely do it if someone asks me to. For now, though, all I will say concerning free will is that it necessarily absolves God of any responsibility for the existence of moral evil. One objection could be that since God created human beings with free will, He created human beings that could sin and therefore commit acts of moral evil, which would still implicate God in moral evil’s existence. It is true that God created human beings this way, though He is still not implicated because He created human beings with an intellect and a will, that is, the necessary conditions for moral agency or responsibility. Thus when human beings act in a morally evil manner, they are fully responsible for that action.

And lastly, God has a permissive will and an active will. God’s permissive will allows moral and natural evils, while His active will does not will these evils. God can allow evil because a) He is not the primary cause of evil and b) because He is all-good, He will always make good out of evil. That’s why Christians believe in the Second Coming, the Last Judgment, and the Beatific Vision—when the new creation will bask in the glory of God, unimpeded by the limitations of sin and evil, which God will put an end to once and for all.

6 thoughts on “Argument against God’s existence refuted

  1. “Now, by virtue of the fact that we can only define evil in terms of a lack of something, namely something good, it is therefore rendered impossible for evil to exist as such, that is, as a substance.”

    I’m confused by this. I mean, I can describe evil as a kind of pain; and pain is something, right? So, evil does not only have to be defined in terms of a lack of something. Moreover, I can define darkness as being nothing but the absence of light; but, intuitively speaking, darkness does exist, doesn’t it?

    There are many other ways to attack these premises: why would we presume to know anything about God in the first place? What if he is a lesser creature than us? Why do we presume we know the definition of perfect and thus what “moral perfection” entails? We have a difficult time determining what exactly is moral in many situations as it is.

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    1. “I’m confused by this. I mean, I can describe evil as a kind of pain; and pain is something, right? So, evil does not only have to be defined in terms of a lack of something. Moreover, I can define darkness as being nothing but the absence of light; but, intuitively speaking, darkness does exist, doesn’t it?”

      As I wrote in my post, there are moral evils and natural evils. To suffer pain is a natural evil, to inflict pain may or may not be a moral evil depending on the circumstances. But this does not change the fact that pain is a deprivation or lack some of good, e.g., pleasure or happiness or health. Therefore, pain can still only be defined in terms of a lack of pleasure or happiness or health.

      I don’t have an issue with your definition of darkness as “being nothing but the absence of light,” though I’m not sure you realize that it further proves my point. You cannot understand darkness without reference to light. In fact, I would argue, just like there’s no such thing as absolute evil, that there’s no such thing as absolute darkness. Even if you were to turn off the light off in a room with no windows and thus no outside light, and the room had black walls and a black floor, the room would still contain photons, and although I’m not a physicist, I don’t see how there could be an environment in the universe in which it is too cold and dark for there to be no photons. So, darkness per se does not exist, just like evil per se does not exist.

      “There are many other ways to attack these premises: why would we presume to know anything about God in the first place? What if he is a lesser creature than us? Why do we presume we know the definition of perfect and thus what “moral perfection” entails? We have a difficult time determining what exactly is moral in many situations as it is.”

      The hypothetical question of “what if he is a lesser creature than us?” makes zero sense. God cannot be a creature, otherwise He wouldn’t be God!

      Moving on, we can know about God through His effects and through His revelation, but because this assertion begs the question, I’ll set it aside. Instead, I’ll come from the angle of natural reason alone.

      Natural theology is the study of God through natural reason alone, without appeals to revealed theology. It is a science just like every other science. How so? (To clarify, I use “science” in its classical sense as a systematic body of knowledge, which is broader in scope than the contemporary, popular understanding of science as the empirical study of phenomena in the world.)

      In order for something to be a science, it must have a subject(s), premises, and attributes that can be demonstrated by means of the premises. The subjects of geometry are shapes and spatial relationships, while the subject of natural theology is God. The premises of geometry are, for example, the definitions of “point,” “line,” and “straight,” while the premises of natural theology are the definitions of “existence,” “essence,” “potentiality,” “actuality,” and so on. The key point here is that the premises need to be accepted in order to engage in the science. You can’t do geometry without agreeing to the meanings of “point,” “line,” and “straight.” Neither can you do natural theology without agreeing to the meanings of “existence,” “essence,” “potentiality,” “actuality,” et cetera. Lastly, with our knowledge of geometry’s premises, we can demonstrate things like the Pythagorean theorem and that the longest side of a triangle is always opposite the largest interior angle. Similarly, we can demonstrate God’s existence and many of His qualities through our understanding of natural theology’s premises (cf. Thomas Aquinas’ Five Ways).

      Finally, all I’ll say regarding God’s perfection is that He has to be perfect if He is to be God. If He’s not perfect, He’s not God. To be perfect is to not be lacking, and so when we say God is morally perfect, we’re saying that He cannot by nature have the slightest deficiency or lack of moral understanding or moral willing. He cannot will evil. He cannot sin. Some matters of morality and ethics are gray to us, but there are no gray areas for God because He can comprehend everything in one single act of knowing and cannot actively will anything other than the good.

      If any of this is not sufficient for you, I’d be happy to listen to your further thoughts.

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      1. “As I wrote in my post, there are moral evils and natural evils… But this does not change the fact that pain is a deprivation or lack some of good, e.g., pleasure or happiness or health.”

        No, according to your post evil does not exist; and now it seems you’re applying the same logic to pain, which I’ll also have to disagree with. Pain exists. It’s a feeling and a unique one at that. It may be caused by the absence of something, but it is something in itself. I think anyone who’s ever felt pain would agree with me.

        And as to your response regarding darkness, I think you might be getting darkness confused with nothingness–they’re not the same thing, nor are they synonymous. It is possible for there to still be things in the universe and for you to be unable to see them. In the scenario that you described, what you see is darkness, thus the existence of darkness.

        “The hypothetical question of “what if he is a lesser creature than us?” makes zero sense. God cannot be a creature, otherwise He wouldn’t be God!”

        I could’ve chosen my words more carefully and said “maybe god is a lesser being than us.” But I was speaking hypothetically to make a point, which was clearly lost on you: I’m not trying to presume any knowledge of God at all, which is exactly what you did in your refutation of what I consider a non-argument. Anything you assert about God is begging the question, which I was trying not to do.

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      2. “No, according to your post evil does not exist; and now it seems you’re applying the same logic to pain, which I’ll also have to disagree with. Pain exists. It’s a feeling and a unique one at that. It may be caused by the absence of something, but it is something in itself. I think anyone who’s ever felt pain would agree with me.”

        Perhaps I should’ve been more clear in my terminology. All I’m saying is that ontologically speaking, evil is not a metaphysical absolute like goodness, and therefore it does not exist like goodness does. By definition an absolute is one, which means there can’t be two absolutes. It sounds silly, but dualistic philosophies and religions throughout history, like the Manicheans, have asserted the existence of absolute good and absolute evil, with both being at war with each other. And that’s a self-defeating claim.

        “I’m not trying to presume any knowledge of God at all, which is exactly what you did in your refutation of what I consider a non-argument. Anything you assert about God is begging the question, which I was trying not to do.”

        In my response to your initial comment, my whole spiel about what a science is—that they all need a subject, premises, and attributes to be a proper science—was intended to not presume any knowledge of God. So go back and re-read that paragraph.

        You can speak of the existence, essence, potentiality, and actuality of things in the world without ever bringing God into the picture. My argument, following Aristotle and Thomas Aquinas, is that once you accept that things in the world are combinations of existence and essence, potentiality and actuality, etc., you can use those principles to reason to the existence of God. Have you ever read Thomas Aquinas’ Five Ways, that is, his five arguments for the existence of God? This is precisely what he does. They can be difficult to understand without knowledge of terms like essence, existence, potentiality, and actuality; but if you are truly open to the idea of God’s existence, you’ll put in the philosophical work, since, as you said, anything that presumes the existence of God is a non-starter for you, which is fair if you’re an agnostic or an atheist.

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      3. “In my response to your initial comment, my whole spiel about what a science is—that they all need a subject, premises, and attributes to be a proper science—was intended to not presume any knowledge of God. So go back and re-read that paragraph.”

        You said something that God cannot be, thus presuming knowledge about God. Re-read your response.

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